The Nugget:
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. (KJV)
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ. (Williams NT)
Joh 17:3 Eternal life is to know you, the only true God, and to know Jesus Christ, the one you sent. (CEV, Contemporary English Version)
My Comment:
I have spent a good portion of last month spending quality time studying John 17:3. This is a most important verse. It is often used by false cults and religions to support the anti-Trinitarian views of Unitarianism, Islam, and the Jehovah’s Witnesses, and others. In my studies of this text I carefully surveyed over 1,300 scholarly works in my Logos library as well as print volumes I have in my personal library that are not in Logos. Out of all these resources I found about three that carefully explain this text. I read these three extra carefully more than once but did not use them in my discussion below.
To understand this verse more deeply, I simply went directly to the text and carefully considered its immediate, its near, its related, and its distant context. I have carefully taken into account the nuances of the underlying Greek text by expressing them in plain English.
If you read my discussions below with care, you will be equipped, as never before, to explain, discuss, and defend the correct interpretation of this passage in context.
This is a very long post (13 pages, 4561 words), but if you read to learn, I believe you will see how to do apologetics effectively and you will learn how to follow the Rules of Interpretation I have championed here as given in the October, 2010 Archives listed on the right-hand side of the page.
10-24-22 Correctly Understanding John 17v3
The Muslim Claim:
Christians say that Jesus came to give eternal life, so what is the eternal life he is coming to give !??
Let’s see from Jesus’s own words
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I tell you, whoever hears My word and believes Him who sent Me has eternal life and will not come under judgment. Indeed, he has crossed over from death to life.
John 17:3
Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.
In both verses Jesus is declaring with no doubt and with no parables nor symbolic words that the eternal life is to believe in the almighty God in heaven who have sent Jesus
Jesus’s mission was only to tell the Jew to recognize the almighty God as the only true God and recognize himself (Jesus) as God’s messenger
This is the eternal life that we Muslims accepted while Christians did not
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My Response:
Jesus was sent on behalf of the whole world, not just the Jews. John 3:16 would tell you that. “For God so loved the world,” one of the best known verses in the Bible.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
This declaration is not a message limited to the Jews but a message that declares God’s love for mankind as a whole, as reflected by what is stated in Titus 3:4.
Tit 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Muslim Reply:
Jesus with his own tongue said he was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel
Who in the world are you Mr big lie to believe you and call Jesus liar !!!!!!
My Response:
It is obvious from your comment that you have not carefully read or studied enough of the message of the New Testament to properly understand it. You cannot base a belief by cherry-picking one statement in the New Testament taken out of context and in total disregard of what the rest of the New Testament and the Bible as a whole teaches about the issue you have raised.
Muslim Reply:
See
It is obvious you are idiot and ignorant
Are you happy now !?
How dare you to judge or decide if I read or understand!?
Because I don’t have the fake nonsense conclusions you made about the Bible so you consider me don’t understand!??
Who told you are underestimating it correctly !? Who gave you the authority to judge me idiot !???
Hey Mr
I am not cherry picking
Explain those verse I shared
Explain John 17:3
1- The speaker : Jesus
2- To whom he speaks ! God almighty you call him father
3- The declaration made in the sentence : God almighty is the only true God and Jesus the speaker is his messenger
What cherry picking !? Cherry picking your @ss
My Reply:
And just what does John 17:3 have to do with supporting your initial assertion that Jesus was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel?
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Let me offer some help to your proper understanding of this verse. Here are my notes as given in my Bible study resource titled The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury:
but unto. or, except to. Gr. ei mē. Jesus did not always limit or restrict his ministry to none but the Jews. He also ministered to Gentiles as here. He healed the centurion’s servant (Mat 8:13); He declared his Messiahship to the Samaritan woman at the well (Joh 4:25, 26), and as a result of her vibrant testimony Jesus was asked by the townspeople of the Samaritan city of Sychar to stay two more days with them, which he did, and many of them believed (Joh 4:42). When Jesus healed the ten lepers, one of them was a Samaritan, the only one who returned to give thanks (Luk 17:11, 12; Luk 17:15, 16). Christ’s directive (Mat 10:5, 6) that his disciples minister only to the lost sheep of Israel and not enter into any city of the Samaritans nor go in the way of the Gentiles was clearly a directive for that immediate mission, and does not mark a permanent policy of the ministry of Christ that limited His work only to the Jews. It is most clear that Christ came to save the world, not merely the lost sheep of the house of Israel, for He commanded that His Gospel be proclaimed to every creature (Mat 28:19; Mar 16:15; Luk 24:27; Joh 1:29; Joh 3:16; Joh 4:42; Act 1:8; 1Jn 2:2). This accords precisely with what was prophesied of the Messiah (Isa 49:6; Act 13:47; Act 26:23).
Muslim Response:
Second of all
How dare you fabricate the Bible and say Jesus is begotten son
All modern translations through this word away as fabrication
Begotten mean sexual reproduction
Did you God sleep with Mary
My Response:
Your objection is nonsense. Once again you are demonstrating your lack of knowledge about what the terms in the text of the New Testament mean.
Let me help you reach a clearer understanding of John 3:16 by sharing with you from my Bible study resource, The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury, with special reference to the term “begotten”:
begotten. Gr. monogenes, S# G3439, +Luk 7:12, lit. the only one of a family, unique of its kind. Monogenes, applied to Jesus, expresses the unique and eternal relationship of the Son to the Father. As firstborn does not mean born first (Col 1:15 note), neither does only begotten imply a begetting, birth, or origin in time. In His pre-existence, Jesus was always uniquely the Son of God (Psa 2:7, +*Isa 9:6, Heb 1:8). When used of Christ, only begotten speaks of “unoriginated relationship.” Only begotten “indicates that as the Son of God He was the sole representative of the Being and character of the One who sent Him” (Vine, Expository Dictionary, vol. 3, p. 140). It is a word picture which portrays the relationship of the Father to the Son in the terms of a Middle Eastern patriarchal family (**Gen 21:12; Gen 22:2; Gen 22:12; Gen 22:16, Heb 11:17). Isaac, termed Abraham’s only begotten son (Heb 11:17), though Abraham had a prior son Ishmael by Hagar (Gen 16:15) and later sons by Keturah (Gen 25:1, 2, 3, 4, 1Ch 1:32, 33), sustains a unique relationship to Abraham as the son of promise (Gal 4:23). The same picture, portrayed in parable (Mat 21:37), emphasizes the unique authority of Jesus as sent by the Father (Joh 20:21, 1Jn 4:9), and our responsibility to receive the truth declared by Him (Joh 1:14; Joh 1:18; Joh 3:18, Mat 17:5). Pro 8:24, Col 1:15, Heb 1:6; Heb 11:17, %1Jn 5:18.
Muslim Response:
Helllooooo
I am discussing John 17:3
Why you are running away like c-ward when it comes to explain John 17:3 !??
Why you are going to demonstrate your stupidity and disrespectfulness by leaving the main topic John 17:3 and going to other verses
FYI, all new translations through away the word begotten as it is fabrication and manipulation
I won’t be distracted as you want and leave the main topic John 17:3
Answer the questions, in John 17:3
Who is speaking !!
To whom he is speaking !?
What is the topic he is speaking about !?
My Reply:
You have brought up a very interesting and important verse!
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. (KJV)
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ. (Williams NT)
You ask:
(1) Who is speaking?
My answer: Our Lord Jesus Christ
(2) To whom is he speaking?
My answer: God the Father, as determined by the near context of John 17:1.
Joh 17:1 When Jesus had said all these things, He lifted His eyes to heaven and said: “Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that He may glorify you,
(3) What is the topic he is speaking about?
My answer: As determined by the immediate context, Jesus is speaking about the fact that the Father has given him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all the Father has given him:
Joh 17:2 just as you have given Him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all whom you have given Him.
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ.
The emphasis is upon the fact that we must continue to know both the Father and the Son in a personal way by having a continuing and growing or developing personal relationship with them both.
Muslim Response:
You lied
3- what is the topic
You answered about giving authority and blah balh which is not mentioned in the verse
The verse is so clear, Jesus spoke to God the father in heaven admitting that the eternal life is to recognize him God the father as the only true God and to recognize Jesus as his messenger
Why you lie !!!!!!!!
My Reply:
You seem to be very clever at using ad hominem attacks but you surely have not responded to what I have clearly written in direct answer to your question.
To properly understand John 17:3 you must take into account the immediate context which is John 17:2.
I cited John 17:2 for you:
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. (KJV)
Joh 17:2 just as you have given Him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all whom you have given Him. (Williams NT)
You questioned “about giving authority” “which is not mentioned in the verse.” If you had read my answer to you more carefully you would have noticed that “authority” is directly mentioned in John 17:2.
Very clearly, to understand John 17:3 you must take into account the context where it occurs. As a careful interpreter I did just that by quoting John 17:2.
For those who know how to read, the emphasis in John 17:3 is continuing and growing in our knowledge and personal relationship with both the Father and the Son in order to have eternal life.
Muslim Reply:
I am not discussing 17:2
I asked clear question and you Jew running away from the answer like c-ward
What was Jesus telling the father in Johan 17:3
Give a direct answer
My Response:
It would help if you would learn how to read and understand what I have carefully written.
Jesus was not “telling the Father” anything like what you suppose. Jesus was affirming the authority that God the Father had exclusively given him, and in this prayer Jesus was praying that the Father would glorify His Son, that He, His Son, may glorify the Father:
Joh 17:1 When Jesus had said all these things, He lifted His eyes to heaven and said: “Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that He may glorify you,
It is you who asked “about giving authority”! I politely answered your question by referring you to the immediate context of John 17:3 by citing John 17:2.
Joh 17:2 just as you have given Him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all whom you have given Him.
You cannot correctly understand what is stated in John 17:3 if you ignore the context.
If that is how you go about interpreting the Bible, then you could justify citing any number of verses or parts of verses together with some rather remarkable results:
The Bible says, “Judas went and hanged himself.” Matthew 27:5
Jesus said, “Go and do thou likewise.” Luke 10:37
Jesus said, “And what thou doest, do quickly.” John 13:27
This illustrates in a memorable way the principle that you must obey the Rules of Interpretation to arrive at a correct interpretation of any Bible verse or subject. The rule of interpretation in this case is to always consider any verse in the light of its context.
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ.
Jesus is telling us that in order to receive the eternal life that only He has been authorized to give to mankind, you must continue your whole life to know in a personal way by means of having and maintaining a growing personal relationship with both God the Father and His Son, our Lord Jesus Christ.
That is the message and the focus of John 17:3. If you choose to disregard this message, you will end up where you most certainly would not wish to go.
Muslim Response:
Nothing in 17:1 nor 2 says what you conclude falsely
Why you are running from explaining 17:3 and resort to 17:1 and 2
John 17:1
When Jesus had spoken these things, He lifted up His eyes to heaven and said, “Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son may glorify You.
He is asking God the Father to glorify him (as a reward for fulfilling his mission) because Jesus glorified God on earth and he praised his name among his people
What in this will make Jesus equal to God??
I am glorifying God on earth and every believer Glorifies God too, so what ?????
John 17:2
For You granted Him authority over all people so that He may give eternal life to all those You have given Him.
Every prophet had authority from God over his people, so what ???
Jesus got authority from God, so God is the source of authority the giver and Jesus is the receiver of authority from God because he is weak with no authority to fulfill a specified mission which is giving people eternal life.
So Jesus we may ask you what is the eternal life that you got authority from God to give to your people ? Jesus answered in John 17:3
John 17:3
Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.
the eternal life that Jesus god the authority from God to give his people is to believe in the only true God the Father (with no partners), and to believe in Jesus his messenger who got the authority from God.
So what hallucinations you are making ??????
The verses is so simple and so direct and you are just twisting them to force your false belief coming from pastors in your church.
My Response:
None of the former prophets ever asked God the Father to glorify them but Jesus did:
Joh 17:1 When Jesus had said all these things, He lifted His eyes to heaven and said: “Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that He may glorify you,
None of the prophets make the stupendous claim that Jesus makes when Jesus said in His prayer:
Joh 17:5 So now, Father, glorify me up there in your presence just as you did before the world existed.
None of the prophets were given authority over all mankind to give them eternal life but Jesus alone has been given this authority:
Joh 17:2 just as you have given Him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all whom you have given Him.
Jesus spoke of this authority earlier during His earthly ministry:
Matthew 11:27
27 “My Father has given me all things. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
Good News Bible
Jesus defines just what is eternal life and how to receive it when he declares:
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ.
So the question we all individually must answer is, do we know the Lord Jesus Christ in a personal way and are we continuing to grow in our knowledge and fellowship with Him and His Father who is the only true God?
The grammar and logic of John 17:3 forbid the notion that Jesus is denying His own Deity to affirm that His Father is the only true God, as you very mistakenly assume and assert.
Your presumed understanding of John 17:3 fails to explain the meaning of this text in the light of the flow of thought in its immediate context. Simply put, you have misunderstood this text by taking it out of context, a very flagrant error in that you have violated the most important rule of interpretation–not to take a text out of context, and falsely arrived at a meaning it does not possess.
Muslim Response:
You will just argue with baseless conclusions using other verses while you deny the simple clear words Jesus said
Because you don’t believe in him as he said but as your pastors taught you how to twist the verses to prove their false doctrine
My Reply:
If you carefully read what I have shared with you about how to correctly understand John 17:3 you may learn some things about how to properly interpret the Bible that you did not know before.
And no, I am not repeating what my pastors taught me about this verse or the Bible. For the most part, thousands of pastors around the world are learning from me how to better understand and interpret the Bible.
I have not been arguing using baseless conclusions. You and many who may believe as you do are the ones failing to obey the Rules of Interpretation and so as a result are misunderstanding what the Bible teaches, and specifically, what Jesus meant when He said what He did in John 17:3.
I hope you will carefully rethink how you are misrepresenting what Jesus said when you take His words out of context and think you understand them correctly.
So the question we all individually must answer is, do we know and have a relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ in a personal way and are we continuing to grow in our knowledge and fellowship with Him and His Father who is the only true God?
The grammar and logic of John 17:3 forbid the notion that Jesus is denying His own Deity to affirm that His Father is the only true God, as you very mistakenly assume and assert.
Thank you for continuing this discussion.
Muslim Reply:
Yes you are
1- repeating what pastors taught
2- arguing with baseless conclusions
3- don’t need to read carefully for your twisted conclusions why !?
Because Jesus explained and declared the meaning in clear specific wordings that need no baseless twisted maniac conclusions you have been taught to desperately prove that Jesus is partner with God in a desperate trial to prove your polytheism
My Response:
You state that I am:
1. repeating what pastors taught
If I am, I did not get my understanding of John 17 from them. I have never heard a pastor teach or preach about John 17, and especially John 17:3, with the depth and precision that I have shared about this verse for you.
But if it were actually true that there are pastors teaching what I have explained about John 17:3, I am glad to learn there are others who understand how to interpret the Bible accurately and share what they find.
2. arguing with baseless conclusions
I would appreciate you being more specific about how I have mistakenly arrived at baseless conclusions. To do so, you would need to cite my argument and specify the logical or doctrinal flaw you identified. You would need to show that I have misread the context. You will note carefully that your interpretation violates the rule of immediate, near, and remote or total Bible context, whereas my interpretation does not do so.
3. presenting twisted conclusions that you do not need to read carefully
When it comes to Scripture Twisting, your misunderstanding and misuse of John 17:3 is an example of one of the most notable to be found anywhere.
You and those who may mistakenly agree with you are guilty of false accusation when you claim “you have been taught to desperately prove that Jesus is partner with God in a desperate trial to prove your polytheism.”
The very terminology you use to express this reeks with Muslim falsehood in an attempt to misrepresent what the Bible explicitly teaches in the very context of John 17:3, and you know it.
Here is the text in question:
Joh 17:1 When Jesus had said all these things, He lifted His eyes to heaven and said: “Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that He may glorify you,
Note that in His prayer Jesus directly claims to be God’s Son, a truth you deny.
Joh 17:2 just as you have given Him authority over all mankind to give eternal life to all whom you have given Him.
Note that Jesus acknowledges that God has given him exclusive authority over all mankind to give eternal life to those God has given him.
Joh 17:3 Now eternal life means knowing you as the only true God and knowing Jesus your messenger as Christ.
Those God has given Jesus, to whom Jesus gives eternal life, are those who “are knowing you as the only true God,” the English word “knowing” representing the tense of the underlying Greek word which signifies to continue to know in a deeper way as a result of continuing fellowship and personal relationship to God through knowing our Lord Jesus Christ as the unique and only Son of God sent to us as God’s Messiah or Christ.
Notice Jesus did not say “knowing you as the only true Father,” but “as the only true God.” The reference to “only true God” specifies God in contrast to all other false gods and idols, as is John’s usage in the remote context found in 1 John 5:20, 21,
1Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us insight to recognize the True One; and we are in union with the True One through His Son, Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
1Jn 5:21 Dear children, once for all put yourselves beyond the reach of idols.
Joh 17:4 I have glorified you down here upon the earth by completing the work which you have given me to do.
Jesus asserts that he has glorified God here on earth by completing the work God gave him to do.
Joh 17:5 So now, Father, glorify me up there in your presence just as you did before the world existed.
Jesus has always existed with God from before the creation of the world, and prays that the glory he had then in God’s presence would continue as it did then.
Muslim Response (10-24-22):
John 17:1
He is praying to his God to glorify him as he glorified God by calling people to believe in Gid
17:2
He is admitting that the authority have been given to him by God the giver the almighty and he Jesus is just weak person receiver
17:3
The eternal life is to believe in the only true God the father in heaven and believe in his messenger Jesus
17:4
Jesus confess and admit he finalized his duty which calling people to believe in God, No crucifix not killing or ransom or this pagan belief
My Response (10-25-22):
Zeyad Ahmed Thank you for sharing your understanding of John 17:3 and its immediate context.
THE TEXT (John 17:1):
Joh 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
Your Explanation:
He is praying to his God to glorify him as he glorified God by calling people to believe in God
My Questions for You:
1. What is “the hour” that has come?
2. Jesus prayed that He might be glorified. To what does this clearly future glorification refer?
3. How will Jesus the Son glorify God his Father?
THE TEXT (John 17:2):
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Your Explanation:
He is admitting that the authority have been given to him by God the giver the almighty and he Jesus is just weak person receiver
My Questions for You:
1. What authority or power has Jesus been given by the Father?
2. Over whom or what has Jesus been given this power or authority?
3. On what basis do you claim “Jesus is just a weak person receiver”?
THE TEXT (John 17:3):
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Your Explanation:
The eternal life is to believe in the only true God the father in heaven and believe in his messenger Jesus
My Questions for You:
1. Where do you get “believe” when the text says “know”?
2. What does this verse say we must do to have eternal life?
3. Why does Jesus specifically state we must know “the only true God” instead of saying “the only true God the Father”?
THE TEXT (John 17:4):
Joh 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Your Explanation:
Jesus confess and admit he finalized his duty which calling people to believe in God, No crucifix not killing or ransom or this pagan belief
My Questions for You:
1. Did Jesus only call people to believe in God when the text states “know thee the only true God AND know Jesus Christ whom thou [God] has sent”?
2. What, according to Jesus, was the work God gave him to do?
3. Jesus stated God has given him authority “over all flesh” or people (John 17:2), so on what basis do you in your Opening Post limit this authority exclusively to “the lost sheep of the house of Israel”?
THE TEXT (John 17:5):
Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Your Explanation:
You did not address this important text which is a vital part of the context of John 17:3. I invite your explanation of this verse.
My Questions for You:
1. In this part of the prayer of Jesus, what does Jesus ask the Father to do?
2. How could Jesus claim to have had glory with God the Father “before the world was”?
3. What relationship to the Father did Jesus have in the time frame referred to by the expression “before the world was”?
Thank you for sharing your insights about these eternally important matters. Thank you for continuing this peaceful discussion. I already have been learning more about what the Bible teaches in response to your comments, questions, and challenges.
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