Daily Bible Nugget #639, 1 Corinthians 13:7

The Nugget:

1Co 13:7  Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. (KJV)

1Co 13:7  Love never stops being patient, never stops believing, never stops hoping, never gives up. (GW, God’s Word translation)

1Co 13:7 It bears up under anything; it exercises faith in everything; it keeps up hope in everything; it gives us power to endure in anything. (Williams NT)

1Co 13:7  quietly covers all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. (New KJV)

1Co 13:7  Love quietly covers all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. (Literal Translation of the Holy Bible)

1Co 13:7 Love bears with all things, ever trustful, ever hopeful, ever patient. (TCNT, Twentieth Century New Testament)

1Co 13:7  Love is always supportive, loyal, hopeful, and trusting. (CEV, Contemporary English Version)

My Comment:

It now has been several posts ago since I was doing a series on the attributes of love given in 1 Corinthians 13. Here is the link to the previous post in that series: https://www.realbiblestudy.com/?p=3466.

If we compare all eight translations above, phrase by phrase, we get a fuller picture of what the translators saw in the underlying original Greek text:

Beareth all things, Love never stops being patient, it bears up under anything, quietly covers all things, Love quietly covers all things, Love bears with all things, Love is always supportive.

Believeth all things, never stops believing, it exercises faith in everything, believes all things, [is] ever trustful, loyal.

Hopeth all things, never stops hoping, it keeps up hope in everything, hopes all things, ever hopeful, [always] hopeful.

Endureth all things, never gives up, it gives us power to endure in anything, endures all things, ever patient, and trusting.

 

Carefully studying and meditating on these attributes of genuine love should guide us in our behavior and direct our focus on what we need to grow in our maturity.

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Some Helpful and Unanswerable Apologetics Resources

The following is a post I wrote (on May 8, 2021) in the Logos General Forum (in a thread titled “Thoughts on apologetics and theological discussions”). It appears at the top of page four there. The thread is now “locked” because several participants “hijacked” the discussion. No one there responded to what I had posted, so I am placing it here for more to see:

I have had an interest in apologetics for many years. I have placed notes on the subject in my book, The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge, at 2 Peter 1:16 and elsewhere throughout the volume, which most of you know is a Logos resource.

I have a printed book that is not in Logos or anywhere else that I know of that has been a wonderful resource. It is by Irwin H. Linton, titled A Lawyer Examines the Bible, published by Baker Book House, Grand Rapids, Michigan, reprinted in 1969 or 1970, a work of 318 pages.

This book has been valuable to me because Mr. Linton introduces many of the classic works on Christian Evidences. Neither his book nor the excellent resources he references are available in Logos Bible Software. I wish they were!

A few of the titles he refers to are:

The Testimony of the Evangelists by Simon Greenleaf

Evidences of Christianity by Chas. P. McIlvaine

Cause and Cure of Infidelity by David Nelson

The Conversion of St. Paul by George Lyttleton

The Resurrection of Christ by Gilbert West

Evidences of the Christian Religion by Archibald Alexander (This title is in Logos)

Evidences of Christianity by Mark Hopkins

Horae Paulinae by William Paley (I have summarized this whole book in the New Treasury in notes linked  to Acts 12:12)

 

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To and For and About Mothers and Their Children on Mother’s Day and Every Day

Mothers

Blessings of. Psa 113:9.

Comfort of. Isa 66:12, 13.

Devotional spirit of. 1Sa 1:15. Luk 1:25; Luk 1:38; Luk 1:46. Act 16:14.

Devout. Gen 21:6. 1Sa 1:22. Mar 7:26. Luk 1:41; Luk 1:46. 2Ti 1:5.

Dishonor to, punished. Exo 21:15; Exo 21:17. Lev 20:9. Pro 19:26; Pro 20:20; Pro 28:24; Pro 30:11; Pro 30:17. Mat 15:4, 5, 6. Mar 7:10, 11, 12.

Duties of. Pro 31:26, 27; Pro 31:30.

Duty towards. Exo 20:12. Pro 1:8; Pro 19:26; Pro 23:22. Eph 6:1.

Examples of: Gen 21:10; Gen 21:16. Exodus 2:21, 2, 3, 7, 8. 1Sa 1:22. 1Ki 3:26. 2Ti 1:5. 2Jn 1:1; 2Jn 1:4, 5; 2Jn 1:13.

Gift of God. Psa 113:9.

God’s care of. Gen 49:25. Exo 21:22. Deut 7:13. 1Ti 2:15.

Grieve over wayward children. Jdg 14:1, 2, 3. Pro 10:1; Pro 19:26; Pro 29:15.

Love of. Gen 21:16. Exo 2:3. 1Sa 2:19. 2Sa 21:9, 10. 1Ki 3:26. 2Ki 4:1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7; 2Ki 4:20. Isa 49:15; Isa 66:13. Mat 2:16, 17, 18; Mat 15:22. Mar 7:24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30. Joh 19:25.

Love to. Exo 20:12. Pro 1:8; Pro 19:26. Joh 19:26, 27.

Motherhood. Gen 3:16; Gen 25:21; Gen 35:16, 17, 18, 19, 20. Joh 16:21.

Motherhood, cares of. Gen 3:16; Gen 21:16. Exo 2:3. 2Sa 21:10. 1Ki 3:26. 2Ki 4:19, 20. Isa 49:15. Jer 31:15. Mat 15:22; Mat 24:19.

Praised by her family. Pro 31:28.

Prayerfulness of, exemplified. Hagar, Gen 21:14, 15, 16. Naomi, Rth 1:8, 9. Hannah, 1Sa 1:25, 26, 27, 28. Mother of Zebedee’s children, Mat 20:20, 21. Syrophenician woman, Mar 7:25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30. Mary, mother of Jesus, Act 1:14.

Rejoice over good children. Pro 23:23, 24, 25.

Reverence for, enjoined. Exo 20:12. Lev 19:3. Deut 5:16. Pro 23:22. Mat 15:4; Mat 19:19. Mar 7:10; Mar 10:19. Luk 18:20. Eph 6:2.

Suffering of. Gen 3:16; Gen 35:16. Isa 13:8; Isa 42:14. Joh 16:21. 1Th 5:3.

To be honored and cared for. Gen 32:11. Pro 23:22. Joh 19:27. Eph 6:2.

To be obeyed. Deut 21:18. Pro 1:8; Pro 6:20.

Tribute to. Pro 31:1-31.

Wicked. Gen 27:6-17.

[From the Subject Index of my book, The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury]

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Christian Evidences versus Evolution

from Irwin H. Linton, A Lawyer Examines the Bible:

One of the fundamental and blessed facts about the Christian religion is that it is a (and the only) fact based religion.

Our Christian faith rests on definite, historical facts and events—facts and events of such nature that if they really took place, the religion is true, and established by so direct, so strong and so great a variety of independent and converging proofs that it has been said again and again by great lawyers that they cannot but be regarded as proved under the strictest rules of evidence  used in the highest American and English courts.

It may safely be believed of all infidel [unbelieving] lawyers [and anyone else] that no one of them has ever made a careful, lawyer-like, two-sided investigation of the  claims of the “Bible and its Christ,” studying and digesting any of the great “briefs” or works on the “Christian Evidences” which gather together and sum up the proofs in support of the Lord Jesus Christ to deity and of the Bible to divine inspiration. I have never found one, and I have hunted for twenty-five years. (page 16, bold emphasis added).

In the last twenty years I have more than once, with no result, challenged large audiences to produce any man [or woman], lawyer or layman, who was an unbeliever who had ever read even one of the old classics on the Christian Evidences.

I have sometimes followed this inquiry for an instructed unbeliever by the statement that “if you do not believe the Bible, I know what you do believe. You believe in evolution.”

I have asked if there were present a man or woman who believed in this theory who had ever read a single one of the scholarly works against it—still without ever finding one such man or woman. (page 17, bold emphasis added)

Concept of the Literature of Knowledge versus the Literature of Power:

Science fits the Literature of Knowledge category because it can go out of date and must be revised or updated. The Bible and Shakespeare fit the Literature of Power because once written, such literature does not need to be updated and does not go out of date in terms of its content.

 

Why is there something rather than nothing at all?

Necessary Being versus Contingent Being:

Necessary Being is unchanging and eternal, without beginning (Thus, “Who created God?” is a question that is non-sensical and not relevant. This avoids the eternal regression fallacy.)

Contingent Beings have a beginning in time and are subject to change. Anything that can change for the better or worse is included in the class of contingent being.

Evolution (macro evolution) is based on the laws of chance.

The laws of chance stipulate that if there are only two options, like heads or tails, half of the results over repeated trials will be heads, and half will be tails.

There is a phenomenon in biology called chirality. Chirality is the label given to the interesting finding that living cells can be right-handed or left-handed. When studied (or synthesized) in the laboratory, cells will sort into an equal number of right handed and left handed examples.

But in nature, living cells are found, with only three exceptions, to be all left handed. Thus living matter does not follow what the laws of chance would seem to predict. That is evidence of design or purpose in the basic building blocks of nature, living cells.

Thus, the naturalistic premise of macro-evolution that life arose by chance is violated, and design and purpose is established.

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Daily Bible Nugget #638, 2 Peter 1:16

The Nugget:

2Pe 1:16  For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

My Response to an Atheist’s Claims

Though the Gospels were written decades after the events they record, that hardly diminishes their historical accuracy. They were written during the lifetimes of those who either were a part of the events or were witnesses to the events. So had the Gospel writers attempted to foist a false narrative upon a supposed gullible public, they would have been contradicted by those alive at the time who knew better, and such errant Gospel accounts would not have been received at the time they were written.

The fact that there are differences between or among the Gospel accounts proves their authenticity, for they were not mere copies of a single possibly fabricated story.

Your assessment of the witness of Josephus is rather biased and one-sided.

As for the other pagan writers you name, they do witness to the fact that there were Christians in their day who held regular meetings and who worshipped the Lord Jesus Christ. That certainly is rather unbiased historical evidence to the fact that there were Christian believers at that time.

How do you account for the rise of Christianity without acknowledging the existence of Jesus Christ? How could a supposedly simple carpenter who had a very brief ministry of preaching and healing that lasted less than four years have made such an impact?

The Bible gives the best explanation about what events brought all this to pass.

Those who REALLY know their Bible know the truth.

My Response to an Atheist’s Answer

Thank you for sharing your view of the Bible. Thank you for sharing that your worldview is humanist. Thank you for reading and responding to my replies.

You state:

“.the fact the gospels were written long after the fact DOES negate authenticity.”

You will carefully note that I stated the Gospels were written during the lifetimes of those who witnessed the events they report. That serves as a definite check against the Gospel writers to make sure they did not report mistaken memories of what actually happened. Since the Gospels were written so close in time to the events they record there is no time for mythical fabrications of the events to have arisen. Internal evidence for the three synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke) proves they were written before the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans in AD 70. The Gospel of John was certainly written before the end of the first century.

Therefore, the evidence I refer to utterly negates your claim of a late date for the Gospels.

You state:

“Contradictions do not prove an event to be true, the opposite in fact…if they all recorded the same event it would have MORE creedence not less, this argument is farcicle.”

To the contrary, if the four Gospels reported what they do in exactly the same way and in the same words that would be evidence of collusion, not evidence, as the case stands now, that they are independent witnesses to the facts they record.

As for the presence of so-called contradictions, these often result from readers not reading carefully what is presented in these historical accounts. They sometimes arise by expecting writers of 2000 years ago to adhere to the standards we have developed in our own culture today.

A major source of supposed errors arise from modern readers not knowing how to read properly–some modern readers seem not to know how to distinguish differences from contradictions. It is a known fact that modern readers often fail to exercise the proper inference skills they should have learned in school or college. Forgive my rant, but by profession I was made a reading specialist so I have many years of experience in this field.

You ask:

“Why am I biased on my assessment of Josephus?”

Your claims regarding Josephus do not agree with the latest scholarship I have read.

You state:

“The Jesus as christ figure is an amalgamation of pre existing pagan myths, making it easy to insert a rome centric deity, inserted by the romans under the rule of Verspasian and under the governship of Titus Flavious. Yes the same Flaviens who took in Josephus…”

Either you or your sources have not properly identified the kind of literature the New Testament is. The New Testament is not myth or fable. It is not derived from existing pagan myths. The New Testament contains primary source historical documents regarding the life, words, and actions of our Lord Jesus Christ and the resulting establishment of the Christian religion.

You state:

“Early christians followed the stories by faith, not fact, as is true today.”

That may be true of many Christians today, many of whom are not well-taught. But it is not at all true of the first Christians who were there at the time when these things took place. The testimony of Peter in his second letter refutes your claim:

2 Peter 1:16  For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

 

 

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Daily Bible Nugget #637, Deuteronomy 22:11

The Nugget:

Deu 22:11  Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.

The Atheist Challenge:

A “meme” was posted of Jesus on a heavenly cloud overlooking the inhabitants of a fiery hell, saying “I told you not to wear mixed fabrics. Enjoy eternity! I love you lol”

A knowledgeable Christian responds:

More foolishness from those who do NOT really know the Bible.

Atheist Response:

Have you worn mixed fabrics? Are you scared you’ll burn for eternity? It is a sin in your book of truths isn’t it?

My Response:

Careful readers of the Bible would know that some regulations given to the Jewish nation are not meant to apply to non-Jewish peoples of that time or today.

Therefore, the question can legitimately be asked:

“Atheists do you REALLY know the Bible?”

While some do, it appears that some do not.

 

Atheist Response:

So these verses are irrelevant to Christians?

What if I told you that Jesus only died for Israel’s sins? (Galatians 4:4-5. Hebrews 9:15.)

 

My Response:

Those particular regulations you referenced about wearing mixed fabrics do not apply to Christians.

Atheist Response:

Jesus came to fullfill the old covenant, not go against it, so why would this verse only apply to Israel? What other scripture can Christians ignore? How about homosexuality, Jesus never mentions it, it’s only in the old covenant, guess it’s fine for christians to be gay, just not Israelies. What other old testament scripture can we just throw out…, you are creating more questions than answers, of the old and new testaments, which can be read literaly and which allagoricaly….

 

My Response:

Jesus died not only for “Israel’s sins” but for the sins of the whole world. The provision was made for all of mankind, but the benefit can only be received by those who truly believe in Christ, whether Jew or Gentile.

2 Corinthians 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

1 John 2:2 and he is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not for ours only, but for those of the whole world besides. (Twentieth Century New Testament (TCNT) (1904))

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 

Atheist Reply:

but god set different rules for Israel from everyone else…why, were they not his chosen people… it says they were…

Also, Jesus never existed outside of the bible, and it’s impossible to suspend all natural laws and make a man live again after death…

Everlasting life is impossible… wish thinking for those afraid of death, the same wish thinking attributed to all early societies, pagan and momotheistic…

These myths and fables have already damaged mankind greatly, we need less of this devicive rhetoric and more humanism. I mean, how many different denominations are there, over 40,000, seems to me some of you Christians are running the risk of heracy, I hope you have the correct interperatation, as worshiping the wrong god is far worse than worshipping no god, making you believers closer to hellfire than even me.

 

My Reply:

If you carefully read what the Old Testament teaches, you will find that there are provisions that apply only to the Jews.

Deu 5:1 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.

Deu 5:2 The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.

Deu 5:3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.

Deu 5:4 The LORD talked with you face to face in the mount out of the midst of the fire,

Deu 5:5 (I stood between the LORD and you at that time, to shew you the word of the LORD: for ye were afraid by reason of the fire, and went not up into the mount;) saying,

Deu 5:6 I am the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

In the New Testament,

Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;

Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Notice especially Acts 15:10.

The fact (as you have correctly stated) that Jesus fulfilled the Old Covenant, in accordance with what He said (Matthew 5:17) is the very reason why the Mosaic Covenant does not apply to us today who believe in Jesus Christ:

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

This is seen by what Paul has written in Galatians 3:24, 25,

Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

 

Atheist Response:

yes we onow Jesus negated certain things, as I said he must have had a change of mind while he was Jesus, but he alsocame to fullfill the old testament…,just one example of dualism and contradiction.

Anyway, I’m done here, you believe your fables of you want, I prefer my reality a little bit more real.

My Reply:

God indeed set different rules for Israel than for everyone else. He was to be their God, and they were to be His people. The nation of Israel basically failed to obey God, and failed to fulfill their intended destiny. But God is not finished with the Jewish nation.

To say that Jesus never existed outside of the Bible is not quite correct.

But if we properly consider that the New Testament is comprised of 27 primary source documents which accurately record the facts about Jesus Christ, it is actually nonsensical for anyone to be so dismissive of these historical documents which contain almost all of what we know about Jesus Christ and the beginnings of the Christian religion. See the volume by C. R. Haines, Heathen Contact with Christianity during its First Century and a Half: Being all references to Christianity recorded in Pagan writings during that Period (Cambridge: Deighton, Bell and Co., Ltd., 1923. 124 pp.).

The bodily resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ is actually one of the best established facts of history, especially ancient history.

 

Atheist Reply

hmmm, the gospels that were writen in greek decades after the fact…

The only writings from the 1st century to survive Jereusalem are Josephuses antiquity of the Jews and the dead sea scrolls. Josephus mentions around 20 differing Jesuses, the small insetion of the Nazrean has been proven faked, a later insertion, with a totaly different writing style. Pliney the younger only mentions Jesus as a retelling of early christian belief, he gathered this information from christians themseves while under persecution, so not eveidence. Tacitus only wrote of Jesus in reply to Plineys letters, they were both troubled as what to do with these christians.

And no, the gospels themseves differ when talking about the resurection, surely something so pivitol would be described verbatum.

And as I said before, it is impossible for a dead man to live again after 3 days…

It did not happen…

And christianity, in it’s direct opposition to paganism, was obviously written about by pagans, this proves nothing more than the rise of christianity, I mean, constantine was a pagan, he outwardly accepted christianity to placate his troops. His triumphal arch shows clearly pagan idols including mithras, and no christian symbolism at all…, strange as this battle was the one he supposedly had a vision of christ before hand.

Even the dead sea scrolls fail to mention Jesus, they mention the old covenant and many ommitted gospels though…go figure, bon of these so called evidences of Jesus stand up to historical scruitiny, no one wrote of the sky falling dark or the earth shaking at the crucifiction.

 

My Response:

Though the Gospels were written decades after the events they record, that hardly diminishes their historical accuracy. They were written during the lifetimes of those who either were a part of the events or were witnesses to the events, so had the Gospel writers attempted to foist them upon a supposed gullible public, they would have been contradicted by those alive at the time who knew better, and would not have been received at the time they were written.

The fact that there are differences between or among the Gospel accounts proves their authenticity, for they were not mere copies of a single possibly fabricated story.

Your assessment of the witness of Josephus is rather biased and one-sided.

As for the other pagan writers you name, they do witness to the fact that there were Christians in their day who held regular meetings and who worshipped the Lord Jesus Christ. That certainly is rather unbiased historical evidence to the fact that there were Christian believers at that time.

How do you account for the rise of Christianity without acknowledging the existence of Jesus Christ? How could a supposedly simple carpenter who had a very brief ministry of preaching and healing that lasted less than four years have made such an impact?

The Bible gives the best explanation about what events brought all this to pass.

Those who REALLY know their Bible know the truth.

 

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Daily Bible Nugget #636, John 3:16

The Nugget:

John 3:16  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The Muslim Challenge:

Praying to a Statue, Believing that a Prophet is equal to Almighty God (Allah) And Believing in Trinity is Paganism. And that is what the Christians do.

My Response:

Genuine Bible believing Christians do not pray to a statue. Jesus is more than a prophet. The Bible declares that Jesus is the unique and only Son of God. Believing in the Trinity is to believe in what the Bible itself teaches.

The Muslim Request:

Can you Please Show me where did Jesus Said all what you are talking about in the Bible?

My Response:

You request:

“Can you Please Show me where did Jesus Said all what you are talking about in the Bible?”

(1) Praying to a statue is not authorized anywhere in the Bible that I know about. Therefore, genuine Bible-believing Christians to not engage in praying to statues, though there may be many nominal supposed Christians in some allegedly Christian faiths that do so.

(2) Jesus is more than a prophet. There is no record in the Bible that I am aware of where any prophet claimed the power to forgive sins. But Jesus made that claim.

Mark 2:5  When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee.

Mar 2:6  But there were certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts,

Mar 2:7  Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?

Mar 2:8  And immediately when Jesus perceived in his spirit that they so reasoned within themselves, he said unto them, Why reason ye these things in your hearts?

Mar 2:9  Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and take up thy bed, and walk?

Mar 2:10  But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,)

Mar 2:11  I say unto thee, Arise, and take up thy bed, and go thy way into thine house.

Mar 2:12  And immediately he arose, took up the bed, and went forth before them all; insomuch that they were all amazed, and glorified God, saying, We never saw it on this fashion.

(3) The Bible declares that Jesus is the unique and only Son of God.

John 3:16  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

I explain this verse in detail in my book, The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge, and its expanded edition now titled The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury, as follows:

begotten. Gr. monogenes, S# G3439, +Luk 7:12, lit. the only one of a family, unique of its kind. Monogenes, applied to Jesus, expresses the unique and eternal relationship of the Son to the Father.

As firstborn does not mean born first (Col 1:15 note), neither does only begotten imply a begetting, birth, or origin in time. In His pre-existence, Jesus was always uniquely the Son of God (Psa 2:7, +*Isa 9:6, Heb 1:8).

When used of Christ, only begotten speaks of “unoriginated relationship.” Only begotten “indicates that as the Son of God He was the sole representative of the Being and character of the One who sent Him” (Vine, Expository Dictionary, vol. 3, p. 140). It is a word picture which portrays the relationship of the Father to the Son in the terms of a Middle Eastern patriarchal family (**Gen 21:12; Gen 22:2; Gen 22:12; Gen 22:16, Heb 11:17).

Isaac, termed Abraham’s only begotten son (Heb 11:17), though Abraham had a prior son Ishmael by Hagar (Gen 16:15) and later sons by Keturah (Gen 25:1, 2, 3, 4, 1Ch 1:32, 33), sustains a unique relationship to Abraham as the son of promise (Gal 4:23). The same picture, portrayed in parable (Mat 21:37), emphasizes the unique authority of Jesus as sent by the Father (Joh 20:21, 1Jn 4:9), and our responsibility to receive the truth declared by Him (Joh 1:14; Joh 1:18; Joh 3:18, Mat 17:5). Pro 8:24, Col 1:15, Heb 1:6; Heb 11:17, %1Jn 5:18.

(4) You claim that “Believing in Trinity is Paganism. And that is what the Christians do.”

By the rule or principle of necessary inference, careful readers of the Bible MUST come to the conclusion that the teaching or doctrine of the Trinity is absolutely true.

Matthew 28:19  Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

This is an understandable but complex subject, complex in that it involves a careful comparison of Scripture with Scripture. I have done that study and summarized the evidence in my book, The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge and its updated expansion, The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury. This information will be found in my note at Matthew 28:19. I share the conclusion of that note with an absolutely unanswerable and irrefutable argument below:

“Several divine attributes are incommunicable: they belong to God exclusively, and cannot be communicated, delegated, or given to a created being. These include eternity (3), omniscience (6), omnipresence (7), sovereignty (30), immutability (31), and immensity (32). Since only God can possess the incommunicable attributes, yet Scripture ascribes them to Jesus and to the Holy Spirit, all three persons must be God. There is no other explanation which properly agrees with all the statements of Scripture.”

 

 

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Unanswerable Proof the Bible is True Part Three


The Challenge:

I lately answered a challenge regarding an alleged contradiction between Matthew’s and Luke’s genealogies of Jesus.

In response, my Muslim challenger wrote:

 
“GOD IS not the author of confusion and these gospels are confusing. I would gladly post more contradictions for you if you would like to tackle them I would be interested in reading your reply to them”

I responded:

 
I invite you to provide more alleged contradictions, if provided one at a time.
 
You ask:
 
There is no historical evidence to anything you mentioned above. Just a book that you have written? Where is this book?
 
My book, The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge (1992) was published by Thomas Nelson Publishers, the world’s largest Bible publisher. It is still available in its digital or software format. The printed editions are only available second-hand, at quite high prices, as from Amazon.
 
I worked on expanding the New Treasury from 2010 to 2016. The much expanded version is only available in software format for use with the free e-sword Bible software. It is available as a “Premium Module” for about $30. It is titled The Ultimate Cross Reference Treasury. It is available from e-studysource.com under commentaries.
 
As for there being “historical evidence” for anything I mentioned above, think about it for just a bit.
 
We could not be talking about Jesus Christ if He had never existed, never entered human history.
 
If what we know of Him today was witnessed by people at the time who saw these events take place, then certainly these events are genuine history.
 
The events were of such a nature that people who were there at the time could see and hear what was going on and could easily judge whether such things were really happening.
 
The events recorded in the four Gospel records regarding the life of our Lord Jesus Christ were events that took place in public. They were not “done in a corner,” that is, were not done in secret.
 
Some events in the life of Christ, such as the Last Supper, resulted in actions or commemorative activities that have been practiced repeatedly in an unbroken series ever since.
 
Christ commanded the rite or sacrament of water baptism as well as the aforementioned rite or sacrament of the Lord’s Supper, which have been consistently practiced from that time to the present day.
 
If our Lord Jesus Christ did not institute such practices at the time the Gospel accounts record that he did, then the practices must have been instituted a good while afterward when the original witnesses to these events were no longer alive to confirm or deny these institutions and their historical basis.
 
But to institute such unheard of practices at a later time based on alleged events which never happened would be impossible because the people upon which such practices were being foisted would know that there never were such practices before in their experience or the experience of their immediate forefathers. Any claims to the authenticity of such institutions would be rejected by all because they were utterly unheard of at or before their time. This makes it impossible to foist such practices upon future supposedly more gullible generations.
 
Therefore, the continued practice of these institutions or sacraments in an historically unbroken series in the Christian church demonstrates the truth and historicity of the New Testament record.
 
The same principles hold true for the Old Testament Scriptures. They provide the historical record of the Passover and the Exodus, the giving of the Law, the institution of circumcision, and the civil institutions of the nation of Israel.
 
The institution of the Passover has been practiced by the Jewish people in an unbroken series year by year since its institution under the leadership of Moses.
 
The Passover and other continuing Jewish institutions serve to absolutely verify the historicity of the Old Testament just as memorial institutions practiced from the time of the events that brought them about by the command of our Lord Jesus Christ establish the historicity of the New Testament.
 
Posted in Apologetics Issues--Other Faiths, Apologetics--Christian, Bible Historicity and Validity, Bible Study Tools | Tagged , , , | Leave a comment

Unanswerable Proof the Bible is True History, Part Two

Unbeliever’s Challenge:

What evidence?

My Response:

Here is the evidence you requested:

(e) Egyptian Politics

Why did Merenptah suddenly have to crush revolt so near home in Canaan as Ascalon and Gezer, tackle long-quiet Yenoam, and get involved with Israel, within his Years 1–4 (1213–1210)?

In ancient Near Eastern empires like those of New Kingdom Egypt or Assyria, it was commonplace for the accession of a new king to be greeted by revolt in those distant provinces that hoped thereby to secure their independence. But here we have something different: not a revolt in more distant regions such as Phoenicia or south Syria (e.g., Upe), but close to home in Canaan, even (Ascalon, Gezer) right under Pharaoh’s nose! This was not normal.

This suggests that there were specific reasons for the Egyptian attack on these places. The critical criterion of a vassal’s loyalty was payment of tribute. Failure to do so constituted rebellion. Ever since Tuthmosis III (1479–1425), this matter had been paramount. And from Lachish, for example, comes an ostracon, usually considered to be of Merenptah’s reign, that once recorded harvest tax payable in Year 4 (1210) to the Egyptian authorities.

Kitchen, K. A. (2006). On the Reliability of the Old Testament (pp. 228–229). Grand Rapids, MI; Cambridge, U.K.: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company.

Continuing my citation from K. A. Kitchen:

But if these towns, Gezer and Ascalon (and maybe Yenoam?), could not, hence did not, pay their tax, then Pharaoh’s army would normally march out to collect it. If marauding bands such as some of Joshua’s (or the elders’) Israelites had come down from the hills at harvest and stolen the grain crops of these two towns, then the latter might well have had trouble in providing their grain-tax quotas to the pharaoh’s commissioners, and had to be cowed into coughing up somehow.

Looking for the source of the trouble, the Egyptian force had then ascended briefly into the hills to chase these bandits known as “Israel,” and knocked off a few of them, by way of warning. An Egyptian fort at modern Lifta (“Well of Me[rn]eptah”) may have been established to reinforce the vassal state of Jerusalem against them. One king of Gezer had earlier been worsted by Joshua’s raiders (Josh. 10:33), and a little later some Judean raiders may have penetrated briefly to Ascalon and its grainfields (cf. Judg. 1:18). So we might conceivably—but not certainly—have an interesting panorama here, hitherto unsuspected. Up north, Yenoam may have had similar trouble.

It is worth remarking that, along with the Song of Deborah barely half a century later, Merenptah’s mention virtually proves the antiquity of the concept of “all Israel.”

His troops encountered people who called themselves not Judahites or Benjaminites or Manassites, etc., but Israelites; and others (at Ascalon and Gezer?) who termed them likewise. And of course, automatically the whole group of these people could only be called “all Israel,” precisely as Deborah did later, in the poetical context of happening to name ten of the twelve/thirteen tribal groups that already made up Israel. Let us have no more silly claims that “all Israel” was a much later concept; Merenptah and Deborah during 1210 to 1160 forbid such an academic faux pas.

Kitchen, K. A. (2006). On the Reliability of the Old Testament (p. 229). Grand Rapids, MI; Cambridge, U.K.: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company.

Here is the direct quotation from Merenptah’s own monument that tells his side of the events. Notice carefully that this is a direct mention of Israel and it is contemporaneous with the events alluded to in Joshua and Judges in the Bible:

The (foreign) chieftains lie prostrate, saying “Peace.” Not one lifts his head among the Nine Bows.2

Libya is captured, while Hattia is pacified.

Canaan is plundered, Ashkelon is carried off, and Gezerc is captured.

Yenoam is made into non-existence; Israel is wasted, its seed5 is not; and Hurru is become a widow because of Egypt.

All lands united themselves in peace. Those who went about are subdued by the king of Upper and Lower Egypt … Merneptah.

Hallo, W. W., & Younger, K. L. (2000). Context of Scripture (p. 41). Leiden; Boston: Brill.

Unbeliever’s Reply:

its almost like you don’t understand what proof is. Notice in the first post. IT SAYS SUGGEST!

There is literally nothing here that disputes my claims.

Thanks for wasting my time reading that…that…Whatever it is.

 

This crap doesn’t even make any real claims. It’s a mess of garbled paragraphs.

What exactly was this supposed to prove?

 

there is no side of the events I listed. The royal courts are the royal courts. What happened when they promoted “god” is literally a part of actual recorded history. There is no side. It happened its not disputed.

You are trying to make claims about magic and unbelievable events that were literally all hearsay. Including the death of Jesus.

The Romans kept excellent records. There is no mention of the crucifixion.

Again… The earliest bible ever found. (You can go look up the earliest bible found in Turkey.)

That bible states in it that Jesus wasn’t crucified.

The Quran also has Jesus listed simply as a prophet. (Another older version of the text.)

Now nothing more needs to be added as long as your cult leaders are keeping their historical text hidden for some reason.

We all know that reason.

The text goes contrary to what the Christians want and is being used for acquiring wealth, power and control.

This is why the Abrahamic cults kill each other. (And anybody else).

There is no justifications for holy wars and crusades other than for control.

ALSO: Nobody is going to burn in a hell for calling this dogma out for being what it is.

Another control tactic.

 

My Reply:

Israel is explicitly mentioned in an early Egyptian monument. There is nothing about “suggests” in that FACT. Since Israel is distinctly mentioned, together with several direct and named geographical locations in Israel of that time, that PROVES the historicity of the Joshua and Judges record.

You asked for EVIDENCE, and that is exactly what I gave you.

It is impossible that these Biblical narratives were made up out of whole cloth many centuries later. A supposed forger would not have been able to furnish the proper place names and setting for the events at a much later time for apart from the historical records we have in the Bible from the time that the events happened and confirmed in Egyptian secular history, all memory of those places would have perished.

Thank you for reading the material I furnished for you.

 

You stated above:

“The Abrahamic story as written by King David is a complete mess of garbled chaotic mythological beliefs used for the political control of the ignorant during a bronze and iron age era. (And up until today it would seem.)”

On what basis or authoritative source do you base the claim that King David wrote the “Abrahamic story”?

 

Unbeliever’s Reply:

Kind David didn’t personally write it. He had his version written.

This your argument?

 

King David’s royal line ruled in Jerusalem for about 400 years.

King Nebuchadnezzar finally captured the city and broke that royal line.

400 years of spreading the Christian dogma as fact to ignorant peasants who didn’t understand where the sun went at night. There was no education system.

Dude…Google is right there at your fingertips.

And your argument is he didn’t personally write it?

OK.

My bad for wording it incorrectly. Nobody knows the exact person. (The Christian Culture keeps their records hidden.)

Its not like there were publishers…

Ya know where on the New Testament it says the “King James” version.

Guess they got that all wrong, eh.

My Reply:

You are free to deny evidence when it is presented. That does not change the facts involved.

I am not arguing dogma. I am presenting the hard physical evidence that substantiates the historicity of the Bible.

 

 

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Unanswerable Proof the Bible is True History Part One

The Non-believer’s Challenge:

The new testament is not a historical record. And is absolutely distorted drastically from its original copy.

David was a king. David did what kings do.

 

My Response:

There is no evidence that the New Testament was “distorted drastically from its original copy.” There is more and better manuscript evidence for the text of the New Testament than for any other ancient documents of important authors of similar age or older.

Non-believer’s Reply to Me:

The hell there isn’t.

Lie to me again.

 

My Response:

You might want to be very sure you have done your homework when it comes to studying about this subject!

Non-believer’s response to me:

as should you.

You spout pure nonsense.

It takes very little homework. The damn thing drastically distorts earlier writings and barely relates to the dead sea scrolls.

Not to mention. It changes names and tries to differ from actual historical writings about gods from the Egyptians that were rooted in polytheism. (That the new testament plagiarized).

See how that works?

 

Your god is literally a political promotion from and for man.

Again. It doesn’t require doing homework. Any quick and basic search will reveal Yahweh (/ˈjɑːhweɪ/, or often /ˈjɑːweɪ/ in English; Hebrew: יהוה‎‎) was the national god of the Iron Age kingdoms of Israel (Samaria) and Judah.

His exact origins are disputed, although they reach back to the early Iron Age and even the Late Bronze.

His name may have begun as an epithet of El, head of the Bronze Age Canaanite pantheon, but the earliest plausible mentions are in Egyptian texts that place him among the nomads of the southern Transjordan.

In the oldest biblical literature he is a typical ancient Near Eastern “divine warrior” who leads the heavenly army against Israel’s enemies; he later became the main god of the Kingdom of Israel (Samaria) and of Judah.

Over time the royal court and temple promoted Yahweh as the god of the entire cosmos, possessing all the positive qualities previously attributed to the other gods and goddesses.

By the end of the Babylonian exile (6th century BCE), the very existence of foreign gods was denied, and Yahweh was proclaimed as the creator of the cosmos and the true god of all the world.

The King David version is not only a fabrication of ideological ideas. Its a perversion of the original text.

In the old testament, god was not only unloving, vengeful and completely different. Jesus was irrelevant.

It should be noted: The 1500 year-old Syriac bible discovered in Ankara, Turkey also indicates, Jesus Christ wasn’t even crucified.

The Abrahamic story as written by King David is a complete mess of garbled chaotic mythological beliefs used for the political control of the ignorant during a bronze and iron age era. (And up until today it would seem.)

To put any faith in it is utterly ridiculous.

 

I’ll also note: I’m not Atheist.

Now provide something supporting your dogmatic gibberish as being factually correct and historically correct so we can compare it to other writings, cultures and beliefs throughout history or consider your claim dismissed.

(Globally historical and recognized beliefs such as the Shang dynasty for example).

Hope you’ve done your homework, pal.

 

Believing in gods is one thing.

BUT

Believing in religion is stupid.

History is dictated by the victor and Christians were victorious for a few hundred years, depending on which sect of the cult you follow. (Islam would probably disagree).

Either way. Religion is political mythology used for control over the masses of the ignorant and is absolutely why the 3 major Abrahamic cults kill each other.

If there was an Abrahamic god. THAT SHIT WOULDN’T HAPPEN!


My Response:

I very much appreciate your taking time to share some specifics that reflect your view of the Bible.

My study sources do not support your view.

I have been reading two books by K. A. Kitchen. One is titled “On the Reliability of the Old Testament.” The other is titled “The Bible in Its World: The Bible & Archaeology Today.”

Both volumes report specific evidence that documents the historicity and truth of the Bible.

I will try to return to this discussion later to give more specifics.

 

Unbeliever’s Reply:

I couldn’t care less about what your studies support. My studies suggest otherwise.

In other words…

You have nothing and are spreading dogma.

(I suggest doing more homework).

You are dismissed.

Thanks for playing.

 

Note: I also couldn’t care less about K.A. Kitchen’s books or opinions.

Grab the 2 bibles yourself and compare the two. And compare them to other cultural beliefs during and prior to the Abrahamic wars and crusades.

Try thinking for yourself.

We all read books supporting our beliefs. I’m Pantheist.

 

Quick question or two.

Do you believe your politicians of today?

No?

Then why the hell do you believe them 1500 to 2000 years ago?

(Especially considering they argued using superstitions).

 

My Reply:

Thank you for sharing some of the books and authors that are of interest to you.

Bible writers were not politicians. Bible writers did not promote superstitions.

My beliefs are based on evidence.

Thank you for sharing the basis of your beliefs and worldview.

 

Unbeliever’s Reply:

Ok.. Who where the politicians back then?

What evidence?

You’ve literally provided nothing but dogma so far.

Thanks for playing.

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